Another interaction with marxmail

update: this submission was in fact posted at marxmail

Interaction with Marxmail, on record

You should just put it on the list. The perspective points to a huge blog literature trying to repair the left and marxism.
peripatetic and juvenile? Nonsense.That’s just mud-slinging. Marxism is dead in the water at this point. I can demonstrate a resolution.
Marxism has to update itself and/or simply start over.
The 9/11 confusion confuses everyone, Darwinism is obsolete, historical materialism is a dead elephant.
Socialists/communists need something they can present to the public that is reasonable and
no longer riddled with ideological idiocy.
At least let the larger left be aware of the way leftist models are on the move.
Thanks for even replying. Actually, this post was too strong perhaps (I doubt it)
and I never expected a response like this.
But I think that you should let the list see the material on stages of production theory,
world history, evolution, and a new form of neo-communism.

As things stand now the Marxist left is done for, so what are your options?
Marxists need to consider critiques of Marx without freaking out or going
to a funk when the limits of Marx’s views are pointed. A century of critics has
left marxism in the dust. But a core can be preserved and/or the left can adopt a simpler
formulation along with some practical suggestions about how to proceed.

Again, I think the list should get out of its cultish fixations. And the marxist package
is is not as cogent as Marxists think. Historical materialism is very second-rate theory
of history and one that about eight of nine billion humans on the planet
reject out of sight.

I will keep trying here and I am grateful you can at least reply.
Marxists should wake up to the weakness of their position.
A group that wishes to critique ideology but can’t see through 9/11 propaganda
isn’t going anywhere.
Don’t kick a gift horse in the mouth. Very few people will bother any more
trying to communicate with closed Marxists.
To me the situation is easy to repair. The left needs socialism
in a more coherent form without a Marx gestapo enforcing Marx’s confusions.

John Landon

Postcapitalist futures: online texts

—–Original Message—–
From: Andrew Stewart
To: Nemonemini
Cc: >
Sent: Thu, Sep 9, 2021 3:31 pm
Subject: Re: deadbeat marxists at the onset of crisis

Your peripatetic wandering is both pointless and juvenile. You leapfrog from 1989 to 1914 to god only knows what.

Best regards,
Andrew Stewart

> On Sep 9, 2021, at 2:14 PM, Nemonemini wrote:
> It is perhaps harsh to critique marxists such as the deadbeat fellows at marxmail. The left went into a funk after 1989 and never recovered and lists such as marxmail slip into a kind of daze or walking trance. Who can actually do anything: the long run of the second international was defeated and the reign of the capitalist bourgeoisie now seems beyond challenge. In fact, not so. As so often the reigning powers undo themselves and end up in self-sabotage. Their stance on climate change is a clear example, and subtly foolish indeed, as it generates the danger of planetary collapse, ‘your fault, and you knew all along’ and soon ‘stare down the gun barrel of enraged planet earthers’. There a dozen ways capitalism could have preserved itself by dealing with its own mistakes. No such luck, double down on catastrophe, take profits as long as possible, retreat to bunkers in Sweden and rid the planet of many billions. In fact, time’s up.
> That’s about the size of it: the capitalist regime suddenly is seen as criminal, suicidal, genocidal, and…unnecessary. Who needs fossil-fueled cars. But the grip of the capitalist mafia is very strong, it is not clear how its domination is to be broken, until it breaks itself.
> The climate catastrophe shows the answer. The recent hurricane Ida prompted the pols out of their morgue into pledges ‘we must act now’. The last chance for reformist change at least is here. After that the capitalist will have left a helpless multitude no other chance save revolution.
> My critique of Marx is impossible for Marxists, e.g. at marxmail, along with breaking out of the stupidity of the 9/11 coverup. The latter shows how the powers that be learned how to fix the left in a subtle brainwashing. How did it happen? We can see now the final last straw: the criminal US can murder its own citizens to stage a war on terror as a way to fulfill Mossadic goals of destroying the middle east, but let the yanks do it for us.
> Marx’s theories need an upgrade. The classic canon as a whole is flawed and now inert.
> It is a situation easy to correct, on paper, but the inertia of the left here could prove as fatal as climate change.
> We have a short text on this: Postcapitalist Futures: The Last Revolution.
> Source: Actually I’m just getting started…as we used to say as kids, ‘we now take prisoners, beg for mercy…’///Good riddance to the deadbeat pseudo-leftists at marxmail – 1848+: The End(s) of History
> —–Original Message—–
> From: Nemonemini
> To: ; ; ; ; ; Nemonemini
> Sent: Tue, Sep 7, 2021 9:26 pm
> Subject: The issue of 9/11
> This is from the redfortyeight blog
> the left and the 9/11 deception//How is it that marxists can’t see through 9/11 propaganda…//posts re: –
> As noted, I brought the issue of 9/11 (and marxist theory) to the Marxmail listserv and was just on the verge of initiating a much-needed discussion of the dismal reign of propaganda on the subject when the gang that controls the list, and opinion there, threatened to unsub me even as they refused to list my replies to their crackdown on their list. From there we got some of the usual idiocy on the subject, suppressing my attempts to reply, starting with the material on the material from Popular Mechanics, one of the most laughable essays on the subject. Even the most cursory review of material on 9/11 will expose the rank deception of the Popular Mechanics crowd. The reaction at the marx list shows the damage done by those of the left who transmitted the mainstream cancel culture here, with Chomsky most outrageously opposing any such review of the evidence. And Cockburn (Alexander) at Counterpuch was another of the pseudo-leftists peddling the official version. To trot out the Popular Mechanics. I have often critiqued Counterpunch on this at this blog, and I suspect that when they posted an article by Paul Craig Roberts years ago critiquing the standard account they had begun to realize the dangers of leftist conformity on this issue. But that however appears to be a first and cogently reviews some of the devastating evidence against the official story. It was this article that prompted me to consider that, finally, opinion on the left was shifting. But clearly the Marxist left, at Marxmail at least, is unaware/oblivious to the issues. This situation is most unfortunate for those who fall in the trap: to be on the left and conform to the official accounts is an instant gesture of self-discredit. For a Marxist to peddle that account subjects that person to instant mistrust and loss of respect. Such is the evidence on 9/11 that you must be either brainwashed, or a liar. We can hardly trust Marxists any longer if their behavior on this subject is this confused, or deceptive.
> Part of the problem is that people don’t read books. When I realized the official account was wrong in 2006 I rushed to read almost forty books on the subject, starting with David Ray Griffin, whose books are key resources: that indirectly shows at once the hold the official account foists on its victims. It is easy to fool people if they have no study skills, never read books, and depend on group channels for information.
> I feel sad that Marxists are so group-controlled here and have to depend on resources like Marx mail to figure their opinions. The situation there shows the proto-Stalinism that has always cursed the left. You cannot deviate from conformity to Marx, or even the issue of 9/11.
> But we can feel confident that if Counterpunch can publish a piece reviewing some of the criticism of the official view, it won’t be long before the whole propaganda here collapses.
> At a time of crisis we need to know what the American government is capable of (or else to use that now almost laughable term), the deep state.
> The question of 9/11 is tricky, no doubt, but the general perception of the evidence and the increasing contributions of experts has produced a literature that makes citing the work of Popular Mechanics the trap that it is.

I raise the issue of 9/11 at marxmail, get threatened with being unsubbed then had to watch a completely dismal discussion of the 9/11 falls flag op trotting out every idiotic cliche from the official acc…


Source: How is it that marxists can’t see through 9/11 propaganda…//posts re: – 1848+: The End(s) of History

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